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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptics own podcast

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episode number 605 for the 17th of May

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2020 Whichard saunders here with you

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from Sydney Australia looking out the

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window cold and cloudy where is the

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glorious sunshine

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I wonder mmm it'll come it'll come

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coming up on this week's show we're

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going to look at hmm

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boobs boobs and pseudoscience can you

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hypnotize breasts to make them bigger

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form a committee member of Australian

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skeptics and one of the founders of the

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mystery investigators science show for

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schools the Linda Brown who lives now in

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the UK she's going to join me coming up

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at the top of the show to talk about the

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time almost twenty years ago she went

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undercover so to speak to a woman who

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claimed that she had the power to

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hypnotize stem cells and make women's

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busts bigger also a Linda and I

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reminisce about the times of she and I

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and some other people would go and

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investigate and test psychics we had

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psychic readings find out all about that

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coming up at the top of the show

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following that it's a story from the

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Australian skeptics website about the

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documentary if you can call it that plan

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Demick and isn't this a golden era for

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conspiracy theorists planned emic the

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anti-vaccine conspiratorial documentary

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plan Demick which makes a range of

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misleading claims about covert 19 has

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been playing a cat and mouse game with

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social media platforms since it was

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launched across a range of sites now to

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just state I haven't actually seen this

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yet I'm looking for a copy but they seem

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to have gone part of the conspiracy it's

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part of the conspiracy it has to be part

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of the conspiracy after that it's

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logical fallacies with Michelle Vickers

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MA and this week Michelle's going to be

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looking at the slippery slope also known

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as the thin edge of the wedge or the

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Domino fallacy

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this is where it is asserted that a

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relatively small step or action in a

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certain direction will inevitably lead

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to a chain of events with a larger end

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negative result proving to be a very

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popular segment logical fallacies with

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Michelle because ma then to round off

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the show some mixed news some good news

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and some crazy news we're going to talk

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about the government here in Australia

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taking action against the Genesis to

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church who have been peddling bleach as

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a cure for covert 19:00 believe it or

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not and we also cover some recent

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protests here in australia with people

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turning up at various parliaments with

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crazy signs and crazy ideas railing

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against the lockdown claiming covert 19

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as a hoax and we're all being controlled

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by the new world order yes we live in

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interesting times but now it's time for

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me to run downstairs and i'm going to

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because i've been watching in the

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lockdown the lock up the locked out i've

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been watching a series of James Bond

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movies but a lot of fun I think I'll

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have a vodka martini shaken not stirred

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yeah I quite like vodka martinis while I

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do that I hope you enjoy the skeptic

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zone

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and joining me now on the line all the

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way from Gloucestershire in England it's

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a very old friend of mine a Linda Brown

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hello Linda hi there Richard how are you

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I'm very well it's good to see you

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through the magic of the the intervie do

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magical zoom out we using zoom today

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yeah zoom is wonderfully clean the times

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like this where we have our lockdown

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yeah yeah because just last night listen

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as I hooked up with a Linda and her

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husband and her daughter and we all used

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to hang out together many years ago in

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the early days of our skeptical

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adventures a Linda was a committee

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member on the Australian skeptics when I

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joined and I came across a video the

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other day Linda I had long forgotten

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about which is something you did way

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back in 2001 folks 2001 you realize I

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was only 12 then you were only 12 which

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makes this next story even more strange

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I wasn't 12 I wasn't 12 I was joking

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yes no believe me she wasn't well I mean

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as you weren't terribly much older no

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you were ye in your mid-thirties roughly

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in your mid that something like roughly

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and you I was approaching my mid-30s but

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I was approaching it from the wrong

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angle that's right and yes and speaking

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of angles you you volunteered on behalf

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of Australian skeptics with a TV program

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at the time today tonight which was one

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of these news type programs yeah with a

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sneaky camera and folks take a big

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breath have another drink a Linda you

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had boob hypnosis can you tell us about

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that experiences what was the whole idea

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what was going on

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oh is this woman who was claiming that

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she could get people to increase their

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bust size

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by having nice thoughts nice thoughts

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yes you are actually asked your boobs

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nicely to get bigger so I know now folks

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to put you out of your misery I'll just

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play a little clip from that story all

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those years ago out of the eternal

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search for the perfect figure these days

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when it comes to improving your bustline

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there are plenty of options other than

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implants and painful surgery pills

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lotions and potions promised a pain-free

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solution but do they work here's how

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long's the market is simply bursting

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with products that promise to make your

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boobs firmer and bigger the internet

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offers a virtual smorgasbord of creams

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lotions and pills there's a special

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suction device guaranteeing you go up a

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cup size in just 10 weeks permanently

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doctors say Bravo will fill loose skin

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with new tissue your prints are growing

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the right size even through hypnotherapy

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we can apparently transfer body tissue

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to our breasts we are asking for those

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stem cells to be sent to where we want

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them to go to build the breast tissue

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larger your printer growing the right

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size so what about hypnotherapy at $40

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an hour

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Pamela Scott thinks she's on to a

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miracle of science gleaned from this

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literature our minds can send stem cells

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to our breasts making a request so to

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speak to send it to that area so you're

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willing stem cells to travel to the

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breast wound doesn't work have you ever

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tried to grow breasts using willpower no

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all right you need to ask nicely today

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tonight asked a Linda Brown from the

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Australian skeptic Society

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to go under Pamela's spell our hidden

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camera reveals it all happens in a

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humble laundry she told me it would

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start having an effect immediately

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unfortunately I'm still the same B to C

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cup that I was before I went in

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what can I say it's kind of Multan so

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there we go a Linda the vision has you

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lying on a couch in a laundry

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yeah we're sort of it wasn't like that

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the back of her house it was it was a

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pretty ramshackle house actually I

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remember when I walked in what am I

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getting into because like that the front

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step was broken she was sitting out in

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the front porch with in it with an

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ashtray that would basically had a pile

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of cigarette butts in it my mother this

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is not exactly what you'd call doctor

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surgery so he took me into this back

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room and laid me down and and started

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playing this tape you know to to

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hypnotize me to get my bust size larger

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needless to say didn't work it's quite

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an interesting clip of you in the story

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in just in a bra measuring your bust

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size and maybe looking slightly

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disappointed very interested the

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measurement before and then I did the

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measurement after and guess what no

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difference now lady in question her name

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is Pamela Scott and just after I found

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this video and I sent it to you and we

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all had a laugh I thought this might

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make an interesting report I've tried to

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find her but I think she may have

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dropped off the radar shortly after that

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because I really can't find any trace

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but it was it was something that was

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almost 20 years ago and she was making

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small sorts of claims about stem cells

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cuz stem cells at the time with was the

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big buzzword wasn't it or the buzz idea

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yeah

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people often ask me why we do these

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kinds of things and the problems we have

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at the moment with coronavirus really

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brings to light the reason why we do

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what we do there's been decades of a war

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against science and evidence and

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evidence and this is the kind of thing

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even though this woman herself was

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pretty harmless

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she was deluded because I

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I think she believed what she was saying

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yeah but still pretty harmless

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but you know when when people believe

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that any idea has value regardless of

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the idea and should be investigated no

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matter how ludicrous it is then we have

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things like a President of the United

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States saying maybe it would be a good

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idea to inject yourself with this this

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is the result of this kind of thinking

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it's it's been a war against science and

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here is the direct result yeah when we

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have a problem like this and there's so

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much misinformation that's just allowed

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out into nowhere an interesting point

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about this whole thing now is that all

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these ideas that were floating out there

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we've been fighting for years you know

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the the quake the quacks and their

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magical cures and their quantum energies

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and all that sort of thing

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and it has done harm in society but now

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it's really coming to the fore because

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they're starting to promote these things

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as cures or remedies or Prevention's for

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coronavirus and I'm pleased to say in

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some cases the media and the government

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are actually now after all these years

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taking real notice and saying hang on

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that's that's the terrible claim to make

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in this time of coronavirus yeah all the

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time

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we were doing all of these things was

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like banging a head against a brick wall

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trying to fight against the media going

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oh we've got a story well now it's a

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case of people's lives and they are

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showing some responsibility and not

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allowing this kind of cracker eating to

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go on but there's this is the result of

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allowing the quackery to go on and and

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and it's the reason why we we need to

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keep on pointing out that some things

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not not all thoughts are equal and some

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stuff is just so stupid you need to

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throw it out yeah it's it's it's

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gobsmacking ly stupid just to us some of

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it really is you know everything needs a

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fair hearing but after the fair hearing

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and it's still gobsmacking ly stupid

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what can you do but it wasn't all it

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wasn't all us looking for quacks and

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things

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all those years ago in the early part of

273
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the the century we were all so are you

274
00:13:00,830 --> 00:12:59,040
and I and our good friend Ian Bryce we

275
00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:00,840
had a lot of fun we investigated

276
00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:04,890
psychics how was it and that would to me

277
00:13:09,590 --> 00:13:07,290
was interesting let's talk about a

278
00:13:13,580 --> 00:13:09,600
couple of the times we were invited by

279
00:13:16,070 --> 00:13:13,590
psychics to turn up and sort of test

280
00:13:18,140 --> 00:13:16,080
them give them a bit of a look over

281
00:13:23,900 --> 00:13:18,150
because they were interested okay Philip

282
00:13:25,580 --> 00:13:23,910
the prize yeah hundred thousand

283
00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:25,590
it started out as ten thousand in the

284
00:13:29,990 --> 00:13:27,330
old days and then it became a hundred

285
00:13:31,190 --> 00:13:30,000
thousand dollars and that's and that's

286
00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:31,200
what they were though they were claiming

287
00:13:34,610 --> 00:13:32,730
it and they all sort of walked in

288
00:13:37,340 --> 00:13:34,620
thinking the money was there the money

289
00:13:40,700 --> 00:13:37,350
was there so one day you know I think

290
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:40,710
about 2003 and luckily this is another

291
00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:42,210
thing I discovered going through some

292
00:13:45,590 --> 00:13:42,930
old archives

293
00:13:48,500 --> 00:13:45,600
I took my video camera and we recorded

294
00:13:51,020 --> 00:13:48,510
made a video we you irony and Bryce

295
00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:51,030
turned up at the house of one Marie

296
00:13:58,370 --> 00:13:53,370
teacher named I think that's how it was

297
00:14:01,340 --> 00:13:58,380
pronounced in 2003 who she spooks spoke

298
00:14:04,130 --> 00:14:01,350
to the spooks so if she talked about the

299
00:14:06,050 --> 00:14:04,140
spooks yeah and she we sat down in a

300
00:14:08,570 --> 00:14:06,060
little living room as far as I recall

301
00:14:11,690 --> 00:14:08,580
she said on the couch and one by one she

302
00:14:15,110 --> 00:14:11,700
read me then she read you and then she

303
00:14:16,730 --> 00:14:15,120
read Ian and then we transcribed that

304
00:14:18,230 --> 00:14:16,740
later on for reporting the skeptic

305
00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:18,240
magazine and still there for people to

306
00:14:21,530 --> 00:14:19,770
look at no link to that in this week's

307
00:14:25,490 --> 00:14:21,540
show notes what are your memories of

308
00:14:28,190 --> 00:14:25,500
that investigation well I was always a

309
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:28,200
lot of fun because yo you and I studied

310
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:30,210
how to do cold reading so we none of the

311
00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:32,490
kinds of visual clues that people look

312
00:14:36,530 --> 00:14:34,890
at so I was used to have a bit of fun

313
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:36,540
looking absolutely nothing like I really

314
00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:39,450
am I'm rather lucky in that I look about

315
00:14:44,090 --> 00:14:41,130
10 to 15 years younger than I actually

316
00:14:47,750 --> 00:14:44,100
am yeah yeah so so I used to rock up

317
00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:47,760
without my wedding rings on and you know

318
00:14:57,449 --> 00:14:54,030
and looking and looking like 25 when I

319
00:14:59,010 --> 00:14:57,459
was yet 40 and this one but she the

320
00:15:01,889 --> 00:14:59,020
first thing she did was ask us our age

321
00:15:04,079 --> 00:15:01,899
yes and I think you told her I said yeah

322
00:15:07,260 --> 00:15:04,089
I said 37 I said it straightaway

323
00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:07,270
there you go and and I said can you do

324
00:15:12,329 --> 00:15:09,490
the reading without knowing my age

325
00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:12,339
because we see for a woman your age is

326
00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:13,930
actually vitally important because there

327
00:15:16,079 --> 00:15:15,250
is a certain time when you're not going

328
00:15:19,500 --> 00:15:16,089
to have children anymore

329
00:15:21,329 --> 00:15:19,510
mm-hmm and I was at the states where I

330
00:15:24,690 --> 00:15:21,339
wasn't going to have children anymore

331
00:15:26,730 --> 00:15:24,700
so she would have known that telling me

332
00:15:29,310 --> 00:15:26,740
that I had to have children be a fair

333
00:15:35,639 --> 00:15:29,320
bet so there I am looking around about

334
00:15:37,019 --> 00:15:35,649
25 26 and looking like a bikie telling

335
00:15:38,490 --> 00:15:37,029
me all these things like I would lead I

336
00:15:39,930 --> 00:15:38,500
was a naughty girl and they need to

337
00:15:40,410 --> 00:15:39,940
settle down and get married and have

338
00:15:46,650 --> 00:15:40,420
children

339
00:15:49,740 --> 00:15:46,660
mmm this and in the end of it when we

340
00:15:51,930 --> 00:15:49,750
were giving her the result I said well

341
00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:51,940
you know here's the thing I've been

342
00:15:56,370 --> 00:15:53,890
married for over 20 years I have three

343
00:15:59,040 --> 00:15:56,380
children and I'm 40 and she and a mouth

344
00:16:01,019 --> 00:15:59,050
just dropped yes yeah yeah because she

345
00:16:02,310 --> 00:16:01,029
had no clue because I mean like I said I

346
00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:02,320
wasn't wearing my wedding rings yeah

347
00:16:05,220 --> 00:16:03,130
yeah

348
00:16:07,050 --> 00:16:05,230
and I looked nothing like somebody I did

349
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:07,060
not look like a 40 year old mother yeah

350
00:16:14,250 --> 00:16:09,850
that's true so she her reading was based

351
00:16:17,990 --> 00:16:14,260
more or less on a false premise with

352
00:16:20,519 --> 00:16:18,000
cold reading they expect a conversation

353
00:16:22,260 --> 00:16:20,529
and of course we knew enough about it

354
00:16:25,500 --> 00:16:22,270
that we didn't give any answers we just

355
00:16:27,810 --> 00:16:25,510
gave yes or no answers so we didn't we

356
00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:27,820
didn't give her back much information at

357
00:16:31,079 --> 00:16:29,290
all because we know that's how that the

358
00:16:33,030 --> 00:16:31,089
the game works when she asked a direct

359
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:33,040
question I think we answered it yes or

360
00:16:38,519 --> 00:16:36,730
no but we didn't go off into details

361
00:16:40,139 --> 00:16:38,529
patient at this she she could then feed

362
00:16:43,079 --> 00:16:40,149
back to us yeah and of course when you

363
00:16:44,610 --> 00:16:43,089
do at this time it yeah yeah yeah and I

364
00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:44,620
know it's worth mentioning and I'm just

365
00:16:48,030 --> 00:16:45,970
holding this up so you can have another

366
00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:48,040
look at that I have in my hot little

367
00:16:53,370 --> 00:16:49,930
hands here a book that you and I both

368
00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:53,380
relied on I still do I know you still

369
00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:55,450
have a coffee this is the full facts

370
00:17:03,750 --> 00:16:57,850
book of cold reading by Ian Rowland

371
00:17:04,829 --> 00:17:03,760
which we well that was about 2002 3

372
00:17:07,110 --> 00:17:04,839
something like that we

373
00:17:09,419 --> 00:17:07,120
we were getting our copies and devouring

374
00:17:10,860 --> 00:17:09,429
those and we know Ian he came to

375
00:17:12,809 --> 00:17:10,870
Australia a couple of times the man who

376
00:17:15,449 --> 00:17:12,819
wrote it and that's been out for lack of

377
00:17:17,189 --> 00:17:15,459
better word that's been our Bible for

378
00:17:20,789 --> 00:17:17,199
cold reading we studied it religiously

379
00:17:22,199 --> 00:17:20,799
we really did and so we were primed when

380
00:17:25,559 --> 00:17:22,209
wherever we went to investigate a

381
00:17:26,970 --> 00:17:25,569
psychic even to this day I know what's

382
00:17:28,740 --> 00:17:26,980
going on and you know what's going on

383
00:17:30,390 --> 00:17:28,750
because of the valuable lessons we

384
00:17:31,860 --> 00:17:30,400
learnt from that book folks it's called

385
00:17:32,970 --> 00:17:31,870
the full facts of cold reading again

386
00:17:35,430 --> 00:17:32,980
I'll link to that in the show notes

387
00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:35,440
interestingly enough for somebody who

388
00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:37,090
wanted to become a psychic it was

389
00:17:44,159 --> 00:17:42,610
basically a to-do list yes but for us of

390
00:17:46,789 --> 00:17:44,169
course it was a to-do list about the

391
00:17:49,919 --> 00:17:46,799
things to look for yeah yeah and how to

392
00:17:53,220 --> 00:17:49,929
and what to do in a cold reading so as

393
00:17:56,220 --> 00:17:53,230
to not volunteer its information and we

394
00:17:58,320 --> 00:17:56,230
soon discovered very soon discovered in

395
00:18:00,899 --> 00:17:58,330
our testing of various psychics that as

396
00:18:04,799 --> 00:18:00,909
soon as you cut off information to them

397
00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:04,809
they go dry very quickly in their whole

398
00:18:12,210 --> 00:18:09,330
routine so start to come out you know

399
00:18:16,950 --> 00:18:12,220
yeah either the moon is not in the right

400
00:18:18,810 --> 00:18:16,960
phase its or it's all back on us you're

401
00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:18,820
a very negative person you're very angry

402
00:18:27,630 --> 00:18:25,330
we had that you're very angry of course

403
00:18:29,190 --> 00:18:27,640
that the classic one as far as she was

404
00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:29,200
concerned if I'm remembering correctly

405
00:18:33,289 --> 00:18:31,450
as well this is what the spooks are

406
00:18:35,909 --> 00:18:33,299
telling me so shifting the

407
00:18:37,950 --> 00:18:35,919
responsibility off her onto us or onto

408
00:18:38,360 --> 00:18:37,960
some mystical spook so it's not her

409
00:18:41,940 --> 00:18:38,370
fault

410
00:18:44,070 --> 00:18:41,950
the spooks we're not providing the good

411
00:18:49,110 --> 00:18:44,080
information on that particular day yeah

412
00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:49,120
the another one very later on she was

413
00:18:53,940 --> 00:18:50,770
quite upset that we published a report I

414
00:18:56,370 --> 00:18:53,950
seem to remember and later on I think it

415
00:18:58,139 --> 00:18:56,380
was later on probably that same year the

416
00:19:00,899 --> 00:18:58,149
three of us turned up at the house of a

417
00:19:04,500 --> 00:19:00,909
mr. sin no his son-in-law I think now

418
00:19:05,519 --> 00:19:04,510
mr. silly it was he was a lovely Fijian

419
00:19:09,330 --> 00:19:05,529
man hmm

420
00:19:12,330 --> 00:19:09,340
and he's some in-laws Australian that's

421
00:19:14,070 --> 00:19:12,340
right and he thought that they were

422
00:19:16,289 --> 00:19:14,080
going to be getting the hundred thousand

423
00:19:18,100 --> 00:19:16,299
dollar check to and they were amazed

424
00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:18,110
again this time

425
00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:20,570
I remember I went in dressed in more

426
00:19:26,950 --> 00:19:22,730
like spring type colors not as a bikie

427
00:19:28,330 --> 00:19:26,960
I looked about 22 yeah yeah and he was

428
00:19:31,210 --> 00:19:28,340
going to tell us anything that was

429
00:19:33,940 --> 00:19:31,220
physically wrong with us wasn't he yeah

430
00:19:36,190 --> 00:19:33,950
I think so you know I don't have a

431
00:19:39,820 --> 00:19:36,200
recording of that I do remember he was a

432
00:19:43,539 --> 00:19:39,830
palm reader so he he sat on the floor I

433
00:19:46,660 --> 00:19:43,549
think and we all said and one by one he

434
00:19:51,250 --> 00:19:46,670
examined our palms and went from there

435
00:19:53,530 --> 00:19:51,260
but my the the biggest memory I have of

436
00:19:54,940 --> 00:19:53,540
that and I'd have to reread a report

437
00:19:58,390 --> 00:19:54,950
again but the biggest memory I have of

438
00:20:01,570 --> 00:19:58,400
that is the disbelief of his son-in-law

439
00:20:03,490 --> 00:20:01,580
who was completely confused and

440
00:20:05,700 --> 00:20:03,500
perplexed that it didn't work with us

441
00:20:08,409 --> 00:20:05,710
because he was sure it worked every day

442
00:20:09,909 --> 00:20:08,419
yeah because yeah because they were

443
00:20:11,860 --> 00:20:09,919
listening information from people that

444
00:20:16,360 --> 00:20:11,870
they were just handing back but I do

445
00:20:18,159 --> 00:20:16,370
remember at the time I in the middle I

446
00:20:21,580 --> 00:20:18,169
said look there is actually something

447
00:20:23,740 --> 00:20:21,590
wrong with me right now I have something

448
00:20:26,890 --> 00:20:23,750
wrong can you tell me what it is any

449
00:20:28,510 --> 00:20:26,900
sort of hundun hard so said yeah your

450
00:20:32,110 --> 00:20:28,520
pains in your tummy period pain type

451
00:20:35,590 --> 00:20:32,120
thing you know and i said no i have

452
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:35,600
whooping cough oh yes that's right yes I

453
00:20:42,549 --> 00:20:37,610
actually had a pink off at the time yeah

454
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:42,559
and he said oh I can't do anything about

455
00:20:51,159 --> 00:20:49,010
of a natural condition and what what so

456
00:20:52,390 --> 00:20:51,169
you can only you can only heal unnatural

457
00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:52,400
conditions what are these unnatural

458
00:20:58,510 --> 00:20:55,730
conditions that you can heal well it was

459
00:21:00,430 --> 00:20:58,520
it was it was a good time because I was

460
00:21:03,010 --> 00:21:00,440
relatively new to the game although I

461
00:21:05,919 --> 00:21:03,020
learned very quickly after studying cold

462
00:21:07,539 --> 00:21:05,929
reading and looking at videos online and

463
00:21:11,169 --> 00:21:07,549
then the best thing of course as we

464
00:21:13,150 --> 00:21:11,179
would go not only to test psychics like

465
00:21:15,430 --> 00:21:13,160
that for the $100,000 prize

466
00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:15,440
we would go to mind body wallets we

467
00:21:19,539 --> 00:21:17,330
would go to live psychic shows so I

468
00:21:21,730 --> 00:21:19,549
think we've learnt an awful lot in a

469
00:21:23,289 --> 00:21:21,740
very quick time yeah the mind body

470
00:21:25,150 --> 00:21:23,299
wallet festivals were all very

471
00:21:26,799 --> 00:21:25,160
interesting because I used to go to the

472
00:21:30,549 --> 00:21:26,809
card readers and things like that that's

473
00:21:32,060 --> 00:21:30,559
right and yes you had a reading there

474
00:21:34,310 --> 00:21:32,070
didn't you yes I did

475
00:21:36,919 --> 00:21:34,320
yeah you did and then you came back I

476
00:21:39,169 --> 00:21:36,929
remember this very well you now we're

477
00:21:40,820 --> 00:21:39,179
talking about it it stood up the memory

478
00:21:42,769 --> 00:21:40,830
you went for this reading and we have

479
00:21:44,389 --> 00:21:42,779
little group of us were waiting then you

480
00:21:48,739 --> 00:21:44,399
came out and she looked you looked at me

481
00:21:52,159 --> 00:21:48,749
and she you said she saw you she

482
00:21:54,139 --> 00:21:52,169
mentioned something she saw me you know

483
00:21:55,669 --> 00:21:54,149
that's what you said and I said what and

484
00:22:00,590 --> 00:21:55,679
she said yeah she said this this and

485
00:22:02,060 --> 00:22:00,600
this and I thought oh that's Richard are

486
00:22:03,979 --> 00:22:02,070
you aren't serious but you said that's

487
00:22:07,609 --> 00:22:03,989
how you know people could connect the

488
00:22:10,719 --> 00:22:07,619
dots you see yes yeah I love it when

489
00:22:13,940 --> 00:22:10,729
they say who's Patrick I don't know I

490
00:22:15,919 --> 00:22:13,950
see a mother figure you must know

491
00:22:18,739 --> 00:22:15,929
somebody called Petra seven I know three

492
00:22:20,539 --> 00:22:18,749
can you give me a last name that's right

493
00:22:22,339 --> 00:22:20,549
from the book isn't it that's right from

494
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:22,349
the cold reading book if someone says I

495
00:22:28,969 --> 00:22:27,090
I see I see am a mary or or joe oh yes i

496
00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:28,979
know three which can you give me a

497
00:22:34,549 --> 00:22:33,330
surname please yes I mean I I do the

498
00:22:37,279 --> 00:22:34,559
same thing when I get these cold calls

499
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:37,289
calling me telling me that I've been in

500
00:22:41,539 --> 00:22:39,090
an accident that wasn't my foot was in

501
00:22:43,519 --> 00:22:41,549
Australia I haven't got one myself I

502
00:22:45,109 --> 00:22:43,529
have heard about them you get them all

503
00:22:47,239 --> 00:22:45,119
don't we get them all the time here

504
00:22:48,979 --> 00:22:47,249
where they ring up and say we have

505
00:22:50,989 --> 00:22:48,989
records show that you've been in a car

506
00:22:53,330 --> 00:22:50,999
accident that wasn't your fault and I'd

507
00:22:55,249 --> 00:22:53,340
say well I've been in three is this the

508
00:22:56,570 --> 00:22:55,259
one where I backed into the wall the

509
00:23:04,580 --> 00:22:56,580
pond where the deer hit me all the one

510
00:23:09,710 --> 00:23:04,590
where I read over the puppy yeah hang up

511
00:23:12,229 --> 00:23:09,720
straightaway let's go they're off this

512
00:23:14,739 --> 00:23:12,239
script they're off their script learner

513
00:23:17,749 --> 00:23:14,749
off their rocker another memorable time

514
00:23:21,710 --> 00:23:17,759
was that we were invited to take part in

515
00:23:23,629 --> 00:23:21,720
a TV pilot of a proposed new chat show

516
00:23:27,499 --> 00:23:23,639
where a group of celebrities lined up at

517
00:23:29,629 --> 00:23:27,509
a desk psychic you came on as the

518
00:23:32,719 --> 00:23:29,639
psychic to do a psychic reading from it

519
00:23:34,190 --> 00:23:32,729
to the to the audience and then revealed

520
00:23:37,249 --> 00:23:34,200
later that we were from the Australian

521
00:23:38,839 --> 00:23:37,259
skeptics and that pilot like many pilots

522
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:38,849
had never made it to air but that was a

523
00:23:42,470 --> 00:23:40,530
fascinating experience well we

524
00:23:44,510 --> 00:23:42,480
well we did a couple of things one of

525
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:44,520
them was cold reading one of them was

526
00:23:49,250 --> 00:23:47,490
hot reading hmm because we planted Peter

527
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:49,260
Bowditch in the audience we did yes I

528
00:23:54,710 --> 00:23:52,170
old friend ratbags yeah yeah and so I

529
00:23:57,880 --> 00:23:54,720
did a psychic reading on him and I mean

530
00:24:00,110 --> 00:23:57,890
funnily enough forgot most things wrong

531
00:24:02,750 --> 00:24:00,120
there was another girl in the audience

532
00:24:03,980 --> 00:24:02,760
who I was I was doing a cold reading on

533
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:03,990
her and she thought I had a direct

534
00:24:10,940 --> 00:24:07,650
connection to God I was just doing a

535
00:24:13,790 --> 00:24:10,950
cold reading it's hot it's it's scary

536
00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:13,800
how not hot it is I'm not very good at

537
00:24:16,910 --> 00:24:15,930
it I mean I can analyze it very well

538
00:24:18,890 --> 00:24:16,920
after all these years

539
00:24:21,290 --> 00:24:18,900
and I have done so many times but to sit

540
00:24:23,150 --> 00:24:21,300
down and just spontaneously do it it's

541
00:24:25,190 --> 00:24:23,160
not a particular skill of mine you're

542
00:24:26,630 --> 00:24:25,200
much better than me yeah well we did do

543
00:24:29,360 --> 00:24:26,640
a bit of rehearsing we used to practice

544
00:24:31,220 --> 00:24:29,370
with people we did ratbags was good

545
00:24:34,340 --> 00:24:31,230
actually he was pretty good yeah he was

546
00:24:37,940 --> 00:24:34,350
I remember one we we just got out a deck

547
00:24:40,550 --> 00:24:37,950
of cards tarot cards just cards and my

548
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:40,560
daughter was having a party and we

549
00:24:44,090 --> 00:24:41,970
explained to the girls what we were

550
00:24:46,340 --> 00:24:44,100
doing and we said we wanted to practice

551
00:24:48,230 --> 00:24:46,350
doing some cold reading with you and of

552
00:24:51,500 --> 00:24:48,240
course they would like 16 year olds so

553
00:24:54,230 --> 00:24:51,510
they were the best fun we ever had was

554
00:24:57,860 --> 00:24:54,240
doing the school shows now that's a good

555
00:25:00,050 --> 00:24:57,870
point folks a Linda and Ian Bryce and

556
00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:00,060
myself were the three original members

557
00:25:05,300 --> 00:25:02,400
of the mystery investigators troupe and

558
00:25:07,250 --> 00:25:05,310
over the years Peter Bowdoin yeah Ian

559
00:25:11,540 --> 00:25:07,260
Bryce's original member Maynard dr.

560
00:25:13,340 --> 00:25:11,550
rachey dr. chrissy and if there's

561
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:13,350
anybody else I'm forgetting forgive me

562
00:25:17,990 --> 00:25:14,970
but the show's been going for nearly 20

563
00:25:19,580 --> 00:25:18,000
years but the three of us we were the

564
00:25:23,210 --> 00:25:19,590
original mystery investigators and we

565
00:25:25,430 --> 00:25:23,220
turned up at the school in the abbot's

566
00:25:28,070 --> 00:25:25,440
Lee school school for young ladies yeah

567
00:25:30,530 --> 00:25:28,080
and we did that we did a free show to

568
00:25:32,710 --> 00:25:30,540
test the waters and that led to the the

569
00:25:35,210 --> 00:25:32,720
show going we did it every year and

570
00:25:36,650 --> 00:25:35,220
since then every year the mystery or

571
00:25:38,390 --> 00:25:36,660
investigators in one form or another

572
00:25:39,740 --> 00:25:38,400
have been performing this is the first

573
00:25:41,360 --> 00:25:39,750
year where the show's in doubt because

574
00:25:43,010 --> 00:25:41,370
of the current situation but we shall

575
00:25:45,050 --> 00:25:43,020
see but that was great

576
00:25:47,030 --> 00:25:45,060
I mean what a wonderful thing to be

577
00:25:49,490 --> 00:25:47,040
powered off when when the mystery

578
00:25:52,340 --> 00:25:49,500
investigators started it was well I mean

579
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:52,350
III mean I just loved you made do

580
00:25:56,360 --> 00:25:54,690
all of these kind of psychic things in

581
00:25:57,799 --> 00:25:56,370
the water divining and all those things

582
00:26:00,860 --> 00:25:57,809
we used to do in the show well wonderful

583
00:26:04,039 --> 00:26:00,870
but what was great was the whole point

584
00:26:06,529 --> 00:26:04,049
of it was showing how science works

585
00:26:09,980 --> 00:26:06,539
showing what an actual double-blind test

586
00:26:12,470 --> 00:26:09,990
is showing how you can see through a

587
00:26:15,590 --> 00:26:12,480
scam with because remember we used to do

588
00:26:17,090 --> 00:26:15,600
that old trick of James Randy's where

589
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:17,100
we'd have the piece of paper with the

590
00:26:21,710 --> 00:26:19,650
horoscope on it and we'd have 12 pieces

591
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:21,720
of paper one for each star sign and we'd

592
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:24,690
hand it around to the room and get them

593
00:26:28,399 --> 00:26:26,250
to read it and they'd all score it to

594
00:26:30,710 --> 00:26:28,409
see how accurate was that all give

595
00:26:32,330 --> 00:26:30,720
scores of not seven eight nine ten and

596
00:26:33,980 --> 00:26:32,340
then we'd get them to hand them to each

597
00:26:36,350 --> 00:26:33,990
other and then I realize it's exactly

598
00:26:38,870 --> 00:26:36,360
the same horoscope and that script was

599
00:26:40,580 --> 00:26:38,880
direct from James Randi and I wrote him

600
00:26:43,279 --> 00:26:40,590
at the time and even he said please use

601
00:26:45,980 --> 00:26:43,289
it although I must I seem to remember

602
00:26:47,659 --> 00:26:45,990
that over the years sometimes you'd get

603
00:26:49,220 --> 00:26:47,669
the odd kid who would say no it's

604
00:26:52,039 --> 00:26:49,230
nothing like me I'm giving it a zero

605
00:26:57,350 --> 00:26:52,049
just because they're 16 or 17 and or 15

606
00:26:58,520 --> 00:26:57,360
and that's what kids - now great great

607
00:26:59,930 --> 00:26:58,530
memories from the early days of the

608
00:27:03,350 --> 00:26:59,940
mystery investigators and that was an

609
00:27:05,510 --> 00:27:03,360
idea we cooked up after we were at a

610
00:27:07,610 --> 00:27:05,520
lunch at an Australian skeptics

611
00:27:10,159 --> 00:27:07,620
convention or a dinner and we were

612
00:27:13,310 --> 00:27:10,169
seated at the same table as a science

613
00:27:18,980 --> 00:27:13,320
teacher and that idea just came to us

614
00:27:21,980 --> 00:27:18,990
then thought wow this would be a great

615
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:21,990
thing to do in schools demonstrate how

616
00:27:26,360 --> 00:27:24,570
science works yeah in a fun way you know

617
00:27:27,890 --> 00:27:26,370
fun and and what a lot and and still the

618
00:27:30,860 --> 00:27:27,900
show still goes on hopefully hopefully

619
00:27:31,940 --> 00:27:30,870
fingers crossed my skeptic says fingers

620
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:31,950
crossed later this year we'll be

621
00:27:37,010 --> 00:27:34,770
performing that again I hope it does

622
00:27:39,799 --> 00:27:37,020
because it's it still performs a

623
00:27:41,659 --> 00:27:39,809
valuable service I think so and I still

624
00:27:43,669 --> 00:27:41,669
get a kick out of it may not any embrace

625
00:27:46,279 --> 00:27:43,679
at the moment are the team and we all

626
00:27:47,930 --> 00:27:46,289
love doing the mystery investigators Wow

627
00:27:49,909 --> 00:27:47,940
Olinda what a lot of happy and

628
00:27:52,549 --> 00:27:49,919
interesting memories from all those

629
00:27:55,190 --> 00:27:52,559
years ago of skepticism part of

630
00:27:56,690 --> 00:27:55,200
skeptical history must much of what we

631
00:27:58,549 --> 00:27:56,700
have been talking about is in the pages

632
00:28:01,039 --> 00:27:58,559
of the skeptic magazine because we would

633
00:28:03,110 --> 00:28:01,049
record it and would we would report hmm

634
00:28:05,550 --> 00:28:03,120
which was I think a very important thing

635
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:05,560
it was certainly a lot of fun

636
00:28:11,460 --> 00:28:08,770
well I hope I hope you don't need to run

637
00:28:12,540 --> 00:28:11,470
off to the next hypnotist for various

638
00:28:14,580 --> 00:28:12,550
body not anymore

639
00:28:18,210 --> 00:28:14,590
no it can't at the moment will not let

640
00:28:19,530 --> 00:28:18,220
leave the house there is that maybe they

641
00:28:23,900 --> 00:28:19,540
can do it remotely because a lot of

642
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:28,260
hypnotize you wonderful to catch up with

643
00:28:32,130 --> 00:28:29,890
you a Linda I hope to see you in

644
00:28:33,870 --> 00:28:32,140
Australia next year I think you may be

645
00:28:36,870 --> 00:28:33,880
planning a visit will certainly catch up

646
00:28:38,850 --> 00:28:36,880
I long as we're allowed to travel I'm

647
00:28:41,310 --> 00:28:38,860
planning to be there next year excellent

648
00:28:43,470 --> 00:28:41,320
but for now a Linda Brown all the way

649
00:29:00,600 --> 00:28:43,480
over there in the UK thank you very much

650
00:29:03,030 --> 00:29:00,610
you're very welcome hi my name's Jo

651
00:29:05,490 --> 00:29:03,040
Thornley and I'd like you to join my cup

652
00:29:08,850 --> 00:29:05,500
I'd like you to listen to my podcast

653
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:08,860
about cults called zealot it's available

654
00:29:12,390 --> 00:29:10,450
pretty much any way you find podcasts

655
00:29:15,930 --> 00:29:12,400
with further reading on the zealot

656
00:29:17,910 --> 00:29:15,940
Facebook page each episode a guest joins

657
00:29:19,890 --> 00:29:17,920
me to talk about a specific cult where

658
00:29:23,940 --> 00:29:19,900
we answer the big questions like is

659
00:29:35,769 --> 00:29:34,210
and does anyone think they're Jesus hop

660
00:29:37,779 --> 00:29:35,779
over to my compound and have a listen

661
00:29:44,190 --> 00:29:37,789
I've just mixed up a fresh batch of

662
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:56,590
[Music]

663
00:30:03,620 --> 00:30:00,350
planned emic this story comes to us from

664
00:30:07,700 --> 00:30:03,630
the Australian skeptics website at WWF

665
00:30:10,820 --> 00:30:07,710
XCOM a u by Tim Mendham published on the

666
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:10,830
12th of May 20 20 plan demmick

667
00:30:20,180 --> 00:30:13,050
conspiracy theory video plays

668
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:21,910
[Music]

669
00:30:27,820 --> 00:30:24,730
the anti-vaccine conspiratorial

670
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:27,830
documentary planned emic which makes a

671
00:30:33,070 --> 00:30:30,050
range of misleading claims about covert

672
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:33,080
19 has been playing a cat and mouse game

673
00:30:39,130 --> 00:30:35,930
with social media platforms since it was

674
00:30:41,770 --> 00:30:39,140
launched across a range of sites it was

675
00:30:44,650 --> 00:30:41,780
initially published on the 4th of may US

676
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:44,660
time on video sites Vimeo and YouTube

677
00:30:49,930 --> 00:30:47,450
and quickly followed on Facebook

678
00:30:53,350 --> 00:30:49,940
Instagram Twitter and even the business

679
00:30:56,110 --> 00:30:53,360
matchup site LinkedIn on May the 7th

680
00:30:57,580 --> 00:30:56,120
Facebook YouTube and Vimeo all said they

681
00:31:00,400 --> 00:30:57,590
were removing the video from their

682
00:31:02,530 --> 00:31:00,410
platforms nonetheless planned Demick has

683
00:31:06,910 --> 00:31:02,540
drawn millions of views around the world

684
00:31:09,700 --> 00:31:06,920
in a post saying the 26 minute video is

685
00:31:12,550 --> 00:31:09,710
an excerpt from the future full-length

686
00:31:16,060 --> 00:31:12,560
documentary the producer of the video

687
00:31:17,950 --> 00:31:16,070
Mickey Willis urged readers to download

688
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:17,960
the video directly and reposted

689
00:31:23,710 --> 00:31:20,810
elsewhere in an effort to bypass the

690
00:31:26,130 --> 00:31:23,720
gatekeepers of free speech rarely has

691
00:31:28,750 --> 00:31:26,140
any such video being so widely

692
00:31:31,870 --> 00:31:28,760
distributed and so quickly and so

693
00:31:35,590 --> 00:31:31,880
thoroughly debunked across an even wider

694
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:35,600
range of outlets in what is described as

695
00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:40,130
a hodgepodge of conspiratorial paranoid

696
00:31:45,490 --> 00:31:43,610
and delusional claims the video centers

697
00:31:47,470 --> 00:31:45,500
on a discredited former medical

698
00:31:50,650 --> 00:31:47,480
researcher turned anti vaccination

699
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:50,660
activists Judy Mike Ovitz apart from the

700
00:31:54,940 --> 00:31:52,490
usual claims about Bill Gates being

701
00:31:57,300 --> 00:31:54,950
involved in the spread of the virus the

702
00:31:59,430 --> 00:31:57,310
film claims that

703
00:32:03,120 --> 00:31:59,440
Mike Ovitz was held in jail without

704
00:32:05,940 --> 00:32:03,130
charge she was actually briefly held on

705
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:05,950
remand after an accusation of theft of a

706
00:32:12,060 --> 00:32:08,770
computer lab notebooks and other items

707
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:12,070
from her former employer the Whittemore

708
00:32:18,270 --> 00:32:15,490
Peterson Institute the charges were

709
00:32:20,460 --> 00:32:18,280
later dropped she also claimed that the

710
00:32:23,790 --> 00:32:20,470
notebooks removed from the Institute

711
00:32:26,070 --> 00:32:23,800
were planted or the National Institute

712
00:32:28,140 --> 00:32:26,080
of Allergy and Infectious Diseases and

713
00:32:30,510 --> 00:32:28,150
its director Anthony Falchi bribed

714
00:32:33,630 --> 00:32:30,520
investors McKevitt Slater used the

715
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:33,640
excuse for her incorrect claims that

716
00:32:39,030 --> 00:32:37,330
I've been confused for a decade and in

717
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:39,040
the future she would try to be more

718
00:32:44,190 --> 00:32:41,890
clear when she talks about the criminal

719
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:44,200
charge I'll try to learn to say it

720
00:32:49,490 --> 00:32:46,290
differently

721
00:32:53,630 --> 00:32:49,500
the virus was manipulated whereís

722
00:32:56,540 --> 00:32:53,640
analysis show that Tsarskoe vyd 2 is not

723
00:33:02,960 --> 00:32:56,550
a laboratory construct or a purposely

724
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:02,970
manipulated virus flu vaccines increase

725
00:33:10,310 --> 00:33:06,090
the chance of contracting covert 19 by

726
00:33:14,110 --> 00:33:10,320
36% the claim miss represents a disputed

727
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:14,120
paper which studied the 2017-2018

728
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:18,330
influenza season predating the covert 19

729
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:20,970
pandemic the claim that the flu vaccine

730
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:23,370
increases the chance of contracting

731
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:26,370
covert 19 does not appear in the

732
00:33:36,470 --> 00:33:32,810
original paper at all wearing masks

733
00:33:39,580 --> 00:33:36,480
literally activates your own virus

734
00:33:42,650 --> 00:33:39,590
you're getting sick from your own

735
00:33:45,190 --> 00:33:42,660
reactivated corona virus expressions

736
00:33:48,260 --> 00:33:45,200
this claim is unsupported by evidence

737
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:48,270
masks prevent airborne transmission of

738
00:33:53,510 --> 00:33:50,010
the virus especially during the

739
00:33:55,790 --> 00:33:53,520
asymptomatic period up to 14 days when

740
00:33:58,460 --> 00:33:55,800
the carriers may not even be aware they

741
00:34:01,580 --> 00:33:58,470
have the disease she also says that

742
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:01,590
beaches should remain open as healing

743
00:34:09,710 --> 00:34:05,850
microbes in the salt water and sequences

744
00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:09,720
in the sand can protect against the

745
00:34:15,100 --> 00:34:12,510
corona virus the video claims that the

746
00:34:18,350 --> 00:34:15,110
numbers of covert 19 deaths are

747
00:34:20,750 --> 00:34:18,360
purposely being misreported in an effort

748
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:20,760
to control people the video was

749
00:34:26,119 --> 00:34:23,610
immediately and widely blasted by such

750
00:34:29,060 --> 00:34:26,129
outlets as the American Association for

751
00:34:32,740 --> 00:34:29,070
the Advancement of science fact-checking

752
00:34:38,110 --> 00:34:32,750
sites Snopes and PolitiFact BuzzFeed

753
00:34:41,119 --> 00:34:38,120
Wikipedia BBC Forbes and of course

754
00:34:44,180 --> 00:34:41,129
in-depth reports on YouTube itself among

755
00:34:46,550 --> 00:34:44,190
many others nonetheless the video was

756
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:46,560
supported by such medical and scientific

757
00:34:54,830 --> 00:34:50,610
experts as entertainers football players

758
00:34:56,659 --> 00:34:54,840
and Instagram influences usually the

759
00:34:59,620 --> 00:34:56,669
preserve of food entertainment and

760
00:35:02,900 --> 00:34:59,630
fashion promoters as well as various

761
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:02,910
Kardashian's in a matter of hours the

762
00:35:07,570 --> 00:35:04,410
video became one of the most widespread

763
00:35:09,830 --> 00:35:07,580
pieces of coronavirus misinformation

764
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:09,840
drawing millions of views across the

765
00:35:14,690 --> 00:35:12,690
major technology platforms its success

766
00:35:17,810 --> 00:35:14,700
underscores how misleading information

767
00:35:20,060 --> 00:35:17,820
about the corona virus crisis continues

768
00:35:23,300 --> 00:35:20,070
to circulate with some indications that

769
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:23,310
growing fear and frustration are making

770
00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:26,370
conspiracy theories more appetizing to a

771
00:35:34,190 --> 00:35:31,490
larger audience earlier research issues

772
00:35:38,060 --> 00:35:34,200
Mike Ovitz is no stranger to controversy

773
00:35:42,140 --> 00:35:38,070
as reported by Snopes in an in-depth

774
00:35:43,100 --> 00:35:42,150
investigation in 2009 biologist Judy

775
00:35:44,570 --> 00:35:43,110
Mike Ovitz

776
00:35:46,570 --> 00:35:44,580
who was then the

777
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:46,580
research director at the chronic fatigue

778
00:35:53,090 --> 00:35:49,010
focused with a more Peterson Institute

779
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:53,100
WPI published a paper on what she and

780
00:35:57,260 --> 00:35:55,170
many others thought to be a major

781
00:36:00,170 --> 00:35:57,270
scientific breakthrough in the

782
00:36:01,820 --> 00:36:00,180
prestigious journal science a team

783
00:36:04,150 --> 00:36:01,830
alleged to have demonstrated an

784
00:36:07,730 --> 00:36:04,160
association between a newly discovered

785
00:36:12,980 --> 00:36:07,740
retrovirus called Xena tropic murine

786
00:36:15,770 --> 00:36:12,990
leukemia virus related virus XM RV and

787
00:36:19,180 --> 00:36:15,780
the poorly understood condition known as

788
00:36:21,860 --> 00:36:19,190
chronic fatigue syndrome see if s

789
00:36:24,790 --> 00:36:21,870
suggesting a potential virus caused for

790
00:36:27,830 --> 00:36:24,800
CFS the paper receives substantial

791
00:36:30,050 --> 00:36:27,840
international coverage however as with

792
00:36:32,420 --> 00:36:30,060
so many other potentially groundbreaking

793
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:32,430
studies nobody including many of the

794
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:34,050
same researchers involved in the

795
00:36:39,410 --> 00:36:36,810
original study was able to replicate its

796
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:39,420
results numerous attempts failed to

797
00:36:43,700 --> 00:36:41,490
replicate the study and the research

798
00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:43,710
itself came under increasing scrutiny

799
00:36:49,580 --> 00:36:47,250
for sloppy methods and its reliance on

800
00:36:53,770 --> 00:36:49,590
misleading or manufactured figures on

801
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:53,780
July 1 2011 Sciences editors issued a

802
00:37:00,350 --> 00:36:56,970
statement of concern about the paper on

803
00:37:03,050 --> 00:37:00,360
14th of October 2011 the authors issued

804
00:37:05,330 --> 00:37:03,060
a partial retraction of their paper that

805
00:37:09,830 --> 00:37:05,340
touched on issues with some of their

806
00:37:12,230 --> 00:37:09,840
figures finally on 23 December 2011 the

807
00:37:15,290 --> 00:37:12,240
editors of science retracted the paper

808
00:37:18,050 --> 00:37:15,300
in full perhaps the final word should go

809
00:37:21,230 --> 00:37:18,060
to zoom-in Damania a physician and

810
00:37:24,230 --> 00:37:21,240
online personality who posted a doctor's

811
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:24,240
react to plan Demick on his youtube

812
00:37:30,020 --> 00:37:27,930
channel this is crazy don't waste your

813
00:37:32,090 --> 00:37:30,030
time watching it don't waste your time

814
00:37:34,610 --> 00:37:32,100
sharing it don't waste your time talking

815
00:37:37,190 --> 00:37:34,620
about it I can't believe I'm wasting my

816
00:37:39,530 --> 00:37:37,200
time doing this but I just want to stop

817
00:37:41,630 --> 00:37:39,540
getting messages about it because it's

818
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:41,640
really frustrating to think that people

819
00:37:47,510 --> 00:37:44,930
are this fricking stupid

820
00:37:49,540 --> 00:37:47,520
really you guys like we don't have other

821
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:49,550
things to worry about than a crazy

822
00:37:54,710 --> 00:37:52,170
attention-seeking person who is using

823
00:37:56,270 --> 00:37:54,720
this crisis to capitalize here she's

824
00:37:57,480 --> 00:37:56,280
been at this for years

825
00:38:02,550 --> 00:37:57,490
go back

826
00:38:03,510 --> 00:38:02,560
anti-vaccine sites you should and people

827
00:38:05,780 --> 00:38:03,520
say oh I'm just attacking her

828
00:38:08,609 --> 00:38:05,790
credibility and using ad hominem yeah

829
00:38:10,349 --> 00:38:08,619
you should look at the credibility of

830
00:38:11,940 --> 00:38:10,359
the people who are trying to convince

831
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:11,950
you that they're right when they don't

832
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:14,890
have any science to prove it then you

833
00:38:18,060 --> 00:38:16,570
look at the credibility and you look at

834
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:18,070
the people that they're associating with

835
00:38:24,210 --> 00:38:20,290
and they're citing and you realize they

836
00:38:24,839 --> 00:38:24,220
are all non credible lunatics done case

837
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:24,849
closed

838
00:38:29,339 --> 00:38:26,770
stop talking about it all right guys

839
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:29,349
share this video I love you and we out

840
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:33,810
peace and stupid

841
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:35,690
[Music]

842
00:38:40,299 --> 00:38:37,970
and that was planned emic conspiracy

843
00:38:43,299 --> 00:38:40,309
video plays cat-and-mouse with platforms

844
00:38:46,079 --> 00:38:43,309
published on the 12th of May 20 20 by

845
00:38:49,430 --> 00:38:46,089
team Mendham and you can read that at

846
00:38:59,310 --> 00:38:49,440
WWF Tex calm a you

847
00:39:03,430 --> 00:39:01,990
did you know that besides the emotional

848
00:39:05,170 --> 00:39:03,440
harm that can come from trusting

849
00:39:08,230 --> 00:39:05,180
psychics and mediums there can be

850
00:39:10,090 --> 00:39:08,240
enormous harm to your wallet uncounted

851
00:39:12,580 --> 00:39:10,100
people have become victims of these con

852
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:12,590
artists and lose vast sums up to their

853
00:39:17,950 --> 00:39:15,530
entire life savings this is Rob Palmer

854
00:39:19,900 --> 00:39:17,960
the well-known skeptic join me for a

855
00:39:22,020 --> 00:39:19,910
zoom presentation where I will tell the

856
00:39:25,090 --> 00:39:22,030
tale of this underreported problem in

857
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:25,100
short I'll explain what's the harm in

858
00:39:29,830 --> 00:39:27,290
believing in psychics and I will lay out

859
00:39:35,590 --> 00:39:29,840
in no uncertain terms just who's to

860
00:39:38,530 --> 00:39:35,600
blame so join me for this international

861
00:39:41,770 --> 00:39:38,540
presentation on Friday May 22nd at 11

862
00:39:44,410 --> 00:39:41,780
a.m. Pacific Daylight Time that's 2 p.m.

863
00:39:47,020 --> 00:39:44,420
Eastern Daylight Time in 7 p.m.

864
00:39:50,500 --> 00:39:47,030
Greenwich Mean Time in Sydney that

865
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:50,510
Saturday May 23rd at 4 a.m. don't worry

866
00:39:55,060 --> 00:39:52,370
if you can't make it the stream will be

867
00:39:57,010 --> 00:39:55,070
saved to Facebook and YouTube for more

868
00:40:03,800 --> 00:39:57,020
information and the link go to

869
00:40:30,510 --> 00:40:28,570
[Music]

870
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:30,520
logical fallacies

871
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:33,290
[Music]

872
00:40:38,510 --> 00:40:36,450
what are the logical fallacies and why

873
00:40:40,770 --> 00:40:38,520
is it important that critical thinkers

874
00:40:43,530 --> 00:40:40,780
should know about them

875
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:43,540
a logical fallacy is an error we can

876
00:40:48,810 --> 00:40:46,570
make in reasoning but it usually crops

877
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:48,820
up when we are discussing or arguing our

878
00:40:54,990 --> 00:40:52,570
point of view some people might even

879
00:40:56,700 --> 00:40:55,000
knowingly use them to try and score

880
00:41:00,600 --> 00:40:56,710
cheap points in an argument

881
00:41:03,180 --> 00:41:00,610
due to intellectual laziness they are

882
00:41:05,430 --> 00:41:03,190
traps we can fall into but if we know

883
00:41:07,710 --> 00:41:05,440
what to look out for we can spot them

884
00:41:14,070 --> 00:41:07,720
when they occur and stop ourselves from

885
00:41:18,300 --> 00:41:14,080
using them this time we'll look at the

886
00:41:21,180 --> 00:41:18,310
slippery slope also known as the thin

887
00:41:24,090 --> 00:41:21,190
edge of the wedge or the Domino fallacy

888
00:41:26,730 --> 00:41:24,100
this is where it is asserted that a

889
00:41:29,130 --> 00:41:26,740
relatively small step or action in a

890
00:41:31,950 --> 00:41:29,140
certain direction will lead to a chain

891
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:31,960
of events with a larger and negative

892
00:41:35,430 --> 00:41:32,970
result

893
00:41:37,980 --> 00:41:35,440
imagine you were standing on top of a

894
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:37,990
mountain and the path down is covered

895
00:41:44,190 --> 00:41:41,650
with ice take one small step on the path

896
00:41:47,750 --> 00:41:44,200
and before you know it you are sliding

897
00:41:51,060 --> 00:41:47,760
down unable to stop and hit the bottom

898
00:41:53,430 --> 00:41:51,070
you end up with unforeseen injuries and

899
00:41:56,490 --> 00:41:53,440
maybe crash into something else and

900
00:41:59,760 --> 00:41:56,500
caused damage that's the basic idea with

901
00:42:02,190 --> 00:41:59,770
this logical fallacy a small action now

902
00:42:05,070 --> 00:42:02,200
will inevitably lead to a chain of

903
00:42:07,350 --> 00:42:05,080
events with a bad result at the end if

904
00:42:09,270 --> 00:42:07,360
they regulate homeopathy the next thing

905
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:09,280
you know they'll be regulating and

906
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:11,290
eventually banning all forms of

907
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:13,570
alternative medicine we see this

908
00:42:18,090 --> 00:42:15,970
slippery slope argument being used by

909
00:42:20,730 --> 00:42:18,100
proponents of so-called alternative

910
00:42:24,060 --> 00:42:20,740
medicine to protect their modality from

911
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:24,070
what would be normal scrutiny homeopathy

912
00:42:29,310 --> 00:42:26,410
like any other form of alternative

913
00:42:32,430 --> 00:42:29,320
medicine and even mainstream medicine

914
00:42:35,670 --> 00:42:32,440
should indeed be regulated as it makes

915
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:35,680
very specific health claims but that

916
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:37,930
does not mean it will therefore end up

917
00:42:43,650 --> 00:42:41,410
getting banned from use in the case of

918
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:43,660
homeopathy it would be very hard to burn

919
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:44,770
sugar pills

920
00:42:52,310 --> 00:42:47,770
if we don't ban genetically modified

921
00:42:55,259 --> 00:42:52,320
foods we'll end up with frankenfood

922
00:42:58,089 --> 00:42:55,269
frankenfood first appeared in 90

923
00:43:00,609 --> 00:42:58,099
in a letter to the New York Times by

924
00:43:03,910 --> 00:43:00,619
English professor Paul Lewis condemning

925
00:43:06,489 --> 00:43:03,920
the genetic engineering of crops it has

926
00:43:09,759 --> 00:43:06,499
continued to be used as a scary term by

927
00:43:13,390 --> 00:43:09,769
anti GMO interest groups but has no

928
00:43:15,609 --> 00:43:13,400
basis in reality this fear of GMO foods

929
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:15,619
arose in reaction to the development of

930
00:43:20,199 --> 00:43:17,690
crops that are not modified by being

931
00:43:23,249 --> 00:43:20,209
selectively cultivated in a traditional

932
00:43:26,229 --> 00:43:23,259
way but are instead modified in a lab

933
00:43:29,559 --> 00:43:26,239
perhaps the most famous example of this

934
00:43:32,259 --> 00:43:29,569
is when DNA plant technology of Oakland

935
00:43:35,109 --> 00:43:32,269
California which has since gone out of

936
00:43:38,229 --> 00:43:35,119
business splice to fish gene into a

937
00:43:40,689 --> 00:43:38,239
tomato the aim was to insert an

938
00:43:43,809 --> 00:43:40,699
anti-freeze gene that helps flounder

939
00:43:46,809 --> 00:43:43,819
survive frigid waters into a plant to

940
00:43:50,019 --> 00:43:46,819
help its resistance to cold the fish

941
00:43:52,900 --> 00:43:50,029
gene tomato didn't grow fins scales or

942
00:43:56,589 --> 00:43:52,910
resemble a fish tomato hybrid monster in

943
00:43:59,910 --> 00:43:56,599
any way however the fear inducing

944
00:44:02,589 --> 00:43:59,920
imagery lives on despite being a total

945
00:44:05,229 --> 00:44:02,599
misrepresentation of a tomato that could

946
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:05,239
have grown well in cooler climates had

947
00:44:10,989 --> 00:44:07,130
it ever been permitted to reach the

948
00:44:12,759 --> 00:44:10,999
market it's understandable to be a bit

949
00:44:15,219 --> 00:44:12,769
fearful of the potential of new

950
00:44:18,910 --> 00:44:15,229
technology that we don't understand well

951
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:18,920
but improving crops genetically does not

952
00:44:25,180 --> 00:44:21,170
mean that we are sliding towards the

953
00:44:27,339 --> 00:44:25,190
development of frankenfoods so they want

954
00:44:30,729 --> 00:44:27,349
to ban the teaching of creation science

955
00:44:33,430 --> 00:44:30,739
and schools what next soon they'll be

956
00:44:35,559 --> 00:44:33,440
trying to close down our churches we

957
00:44:38,319 --> 00:44:35,569
mentioned so called creation science in

958
00:44:40,299 --> 00:44:38,329
the middle ground fallacy while there

959
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:40,309
are very good reasons not to teach this

960
00:44:45,130 --> 00:44:42,650
religion based mythology posing as a

961
00:44:49,209 --> 00:44:45,140
science in the classroom it does not

962
00:44:50,859 --> 00:44:49,219
therefore mean people should or will be

963
00:44:55,049 --> 00:44:50,869
stopped from practicing their own

964
00:44:57,519 --> 00:44:55,059
religion in their own places of worship

965
00:45:00,189 --> 00:44:57,529
yes there are slippery slopes in this

966
00:45:02,380 --> 00:45:00,199
world but there are also ways and means

967
00:45:03,579 --> 00:45:02,390
of avoiding them or breaking the chain

968
00:45:05,890 --> 00:45:03,589
of events

969
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:05,900
just because something you do might lead

970
00:45:12,489 --> 00:45:08,690
to a larger and negative outcome it

971
00:45:14,799 --> 00:45:12,499
doesn't mean it always will small risks

972
00:45:18,969 --> 00:45:14,809
you take now can be a step in the wrong

973
00:45:25,269 --> 00:45:18,979
or in the right direction one thing does

974
00:45:27,339 --> 00:45:25,279
not always lead to another knowing a

975
00:45:30,519 --> 00:45:27,349
logical fallacy when you hear one and

976
00:45:32,519 --> 00:45:30,529
even knowing its name is important when

977
00:45:35,529 --> 00:45:32,529
arguing your point of view

978
00:45:38,859 --> 00:45:35,539
however you may come across as arrogant

979
00:45:41,589 --> 00:45:38,869
and not get very far if you call it out

980
00:45:45,789 --> 00:45:41,599
by name to your opponent when you hear

981
00:45:48,700 --> 00:45:45,799
it being used if your opponent calls you

982
00:45:52,019 --> 00:45:48,710
out for using one it's time to stop and

983
00:45:54,599 --> 00:45:52,029
think about how you are making your case

984
00:45:58,359 --> 00:45:54,609
use your knowledge of logical fallacies

985
00:46:00,999 --> 00:45:58,369
wisely and remember that even if your

986
00:46:03,849 --> 00:46:01,009
point of view is right and you know all

987
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:03,859
the pitfalls in arguing your case it

988
00:46:10,359 --> 00:46:06,170
doesn't always mean you'll win on the

989
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:10,369
day and a skeptics we must also remember

990
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:16,130
that we too can be wrong at times I'm

991
00:46:32,010 --> 00:46:18,650
sure because my from the Vick skeptics

992
00:46:38,140 --> 00:46:36,190
mmm I wonder if the Australian skeptics

993
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:38,150
National Convention skeptic on they're

994
00:46:43,990 --> 00:46:40,010
still going ahead this year on the Gold

995
00:46:46,210 --> 00:46:44,000
Coast in Queensland of all this of all

996
00:46:51,370 --> 00:46:46,220
this lockdown and virus situation

997
00:46:54,850 --> 00:46:51,380
worldwide hmm let's ease drop in one of

998
00:47:04,810 --> 00:46:54,860
the online meeting sessions of the

999
00:47:06,570 --> 00:47:04,820
organizing committee okay April 9 nice

1000
00:47:09,190 --> 00:47:06,580
to see you in your virtual bubble it's

1001
00:47:12,250 --> 00:47:09,200
it's been interesting having all our

1002
00:47:14,230 --> 00:47:12,260
skeptic on meetings online hasn't it yes

1003
00:47:16,300 --> 00:47:14,240
so looking forward to seeing you in real

1004
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:16,310
life

1005
00:47:20,410 --> 00:47:18,410
I keep getting some questions about our

1006
00:47:23,620 --> 00:47:20,420
conference the script on happening on

1007
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:23,630
the coast where our plans yeah

1008
00:47:28,210 --> 00:47:25,970
definitely still going ahead at this

1009
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:28,220
point where we're looking pretty good in

1010
00:47:32,650 --> 00:47:30,410
Australia in terms of what's happening

1011
00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:32,660
with our global pandemic locally the

1012
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:34,250
numbers are looking good we all know

1013
00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:35,690
that recently there have been some

1014
00:47:40,630 --> 00:47:38,570
restrictions that are eased so given

1015
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:40,640
that we will know in about two to four

1016
00:47:44,500 --> 00:47:42,530
weeks where that curve is trending

1017
00:47:47,740 --> 00:47:44,510
hopefully we'll be able to make a firm

1018
00:47:50,670 --> 00:47:47,750
announce then in early to mid June so

1019
00:47:54,010 --> 00:47:50,680
that might be either going full online

1020
00:47:56,230 --> 00:47:54,020
or face-to-face especially if the

1021
00:47:58,990 --> 00:47:56,240
borders between states have opened up or

1022
00:48:01,780 --> 00:47:59,000
we might do a bit of a mixed model where

1023
00:48:04,030 --> 00:48:01,790
we have some online and some

1024
00:48:07,330 --> 00:48:04,040
face-to-face audience members and

1025
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:07,340
speakers and fantastic let's hope it's

1026
00:48:15,370 --> 00:48:11,450
face to face what was it in the dates

1027
00:48:17,260 --> 00:48:15,380
our October 23rd to the 25th so that's

1028
00:48:20,170 --> 00:48:17,270
from the Friday evening until Sunday

1029
00:48:21,340 --> 00:48:20,180
easy um I've also had a few people ask

1030
00:48:23,230 --> 00:48:21,350
whether they can speak at this

1031
00:48:27,250 --> 00:48:23,240
conference are we putting out a call for

1032
00:48:29,500 --> 00:48:27,260
papers absolutely so we really like to

1033
00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:29,510
hear from the skeptical community we've

1034
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:32,210
already put some invitations out to

1035
00:48:37,150 --> 00:48:35,450
local speakers that we know are very

1036
00:48:39,250 --> 00:48:37,160
good and many of them have already

1037
00:48:41,170 --> 00:48:39,260
accepted so that's really exciting but

1038
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:41,180
we do have a couple of spots left for

1039
00:48:45,830 --> 00:48:44,810
those keen people out in the skeptics

1040
00:48:48,590 --> 00:48:45,840
here

1041
00:48:51,470 --> 00:48:48,600
so if you want to give us your idea just

1042
00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:51,480
go to skeptic on.org today you just

1043
00:48:54,950 --> 00:48:53,370
under the speaker's tab there is a call

1044
00:48:56,510 --> 00:48:54,960
for papers so you just need to fill out

1045
00:48:58,790 --> 00:48:56,520
the form and let us know what you'd like

1046
00:49:02,570 --> 00:48:58,800
to talk to us about sounds exciting in

1047
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:02,580
some stead alright well hopefully I get

1048
00:49:08,990 --> 00:49:07,170
to say URL soon Sarah yes across here -

1049
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:09,000
never good a little and look after

1050
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:17,690
yourself so there you go skeptic on

1051
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:20,880
still going ahead on the Gold Coast 23rd

1052
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:24,690
to the 25th of October 2020 and it seems

1053
00:49:28,820 --> 00:49:26,570
like the committee are planning for

1054
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:28,830
every possibility

1055
00:49:36,650 --> 00:49:32,810
relating to the covert 19 situation I

1056
00:49:39,830 --> 00:49:36,660
think I'd better go to skeptic on org

1057
00:49:48,490 --> 00:49:39,840
got a you to find out more

1058
00:49:58,420 --> 00:49:55,620
[Music]

1059
00:50:01,620 --> 00:49:58,430
now here's some good action taken by the

1060
00:50:04,450 --> 00:50:01,630
TGA the Therapeutic Goods Administration

1061
00:50:05,550 --> 00:50:04,460
with the press release dated the 13th of

1062
00:50:11,460 --> 00:50:05,560
May 2020

1063
00:50:15,730 --> 00:50:11,470
mm s Australia find a hundred and fifty

1064
00:50:19,060 --> 00:50:15,740
$1200 for alleged unlawful advertising

1065
00:50:22,900 --> 00:50:19,070
the TGA is the Australian Government's

1066
00:50:26,140 --> 00:50:22,910
Department of Health therapeutics Goods

1067
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:26,150
Administration the therapeutics Goods

1068
00:50:30,430 --> 00:50:27,410
Administration TGA

1069
00:50:33,310 --> 00:50:30,440
has issued 12 infringement notices

1070
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:33,320
totaling a hundred and fifty 1200

1071
00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:36,010
dollars for the alleged unlawful

1072
00:50:43,089 --> 00:50:39,290
advertising of miracle mineral

1073
00:50:46,900 --> 00:50:43,099
supplement also referred to as miracle

1074
00:50:48,849 --> 00:50:46,910
mineral solution mms and other medicines

1075
00:50:51,550 --> 00:50:48,859
by Southern Cross directories

1076
00:50:54,940 --> 00:50:51,560
proprietary limited trading as MS

1077
00:50:57,760 --> 00:50:54,950
Australia the TGA is concerned about the

1078
00:51:01,300 --> 00:50:57,770
harmful effects that can be caused by

1079
00:51:03,670 --> 00:51:01,310
the ingestion of mms and has published

1080
00:51:07,420 --> 00:51:03,680
an update safety alert to warn consumers

1081
00:51:10,570 --> 00:51:07,430
about claims made online about miracle

1082
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:10,580
mineral solution mms for the treatment

1083
00:51:17,290 --> 00:51:13,970
cure prevention or alleviation of

1084
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:17,300
disease including cove at 19

1085
00:51:22,690 --> 00:51:19,970
there is no clinical scientifically

1086
00:51:26,050 --> 00:51:22,700
accepted evidence showing that mms can

1087
00:51:28,870 --> 00:51:26,060
cure or alleviate any disease the use of

1088
00:51:31,839 --> 00:51:28,880
mms presents serious health risks that

1089
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:31,849
can result in nausea vomiting diarrhea

1090
00:51:38,609 --> 00:51:35,690
and severe dehydration which in some

1091
00:51:41,290 --> 00:51:38,619
cases can result in hospitalization as

1092
00:51:43,570 --> 00:51:41,300
mms Australia has promoted a number of

1093
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:43,580
its products as being for therapeutic

1094
00:51:49,060 --> 00:51:46,490
uses the products are subject to the

1095
00:51:52,650 --> 00:51:49,070
regulatory framework established under

1096
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:52,660
the therapeutics Goods Act 1999 and

1097
00:51:58,990 --> 00:51:56,810
administered by the TGA and we find

1098
00:52:02,730 --> 00:51:59,000
further information on the website of

1099
00:52:06,510 --> 00:52:02,740
ABC News ABC News doc net dot a you

1100
00:52:08,950 --> 00:52:06,520
Church in Australia selling bleach as

1101
00:52:10,240 --> 00:52:08,960
coronavirus treatment fined 100

1102
00:52:13,990 --> 00:52:10,250
fifty-one thousand two hundred dollars

1103
00:52:18,420 --> 00:52:14,000
and this was published on the 14th of

1104
00:52:20,859 --> 00:52:18,430
May by grace Tobin and it says in part

1105
00:52:22,900 --> 00:52:20,869
the Australian chapter of an

1106
00:52:27,310 --> 00:52:22,910
international church selling and

1107
00:52:29,290 --> 00:52:27,320
promoting bleach as a cure for covert 19

1108
00:52:33,430 --> 00:52:29,300
has been issued with infringement

1109
00:52:34,060 --> 00:52:33,440
notices the Genesis to church of health

1110
00:52:37,980 --> 00:52:34,070
and healing

1111
00:52:42,820 --> 00:52:37,990
has been claiming chlorine oxide is a

1112
00:52:44,940 --> 00:52:42,830
quote miracle cure unquote for years it

1113
00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:44,950
has solved the industrial bleach as

1114
00:52:53,829 --> 00:52:49,490
miracle mineral solution mms stating and

1115
00:52:59,320 --> 00:52:53,839
can cure things like autism acne cancer

1116
00:53:01,359 --> 00:52:59,330
diabetes and now co vat19 mms has not

1117
00:53:04,270 --> 00:53:01,369
been approved for human consumption in

1118
00:53:07,120 --> 00:53:04,280
australia it is being sold as quote

1119
00:53:09,550 --> 00:53:07,130
water purification drops and quote on

1120
00:53:13,089 --> 00:53:09,560
the website of the australian chapter of

1121
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:13,099
the church mms australia and this comes

1122
00:53:19,359 --> 00:53:15,770
about from an investigation by the 730

1123
00:53:22,240 --> 00:53:19,369
program on the ABC television it goes on

1124
00:53:24,220 --> 00:53:22,250
to say a TGA spokesman told 730 it was

1125
00:53:26,950 --> 00:53:24,230
concerned about the harmful effects that

1126
00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:26,960
could be caused by the ingestion of mms

1127
00:53:33,310 --> 00:53:29,210
and our friend associate professor ken

1128
00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:33,320
harvey as a mentioned here associate

1129
00:53:38,020 --> 00:53:35,810
professor ken harvey an expert in public

1130
00:53:41,410 --> 00:53:38,030
health from Monash University has been

1131
00:53:43,140 --> 00:53:41,420
lobbying the TGA to ban the sale of mms

1132
00:53:46,690 --> 00:53:43,150
in Australia for the past ten years

1133
00:53:49,630 --> 00:53:46,700
quote it is dangerous in quote associate

1134
00:53:52,450 --> 00:53:49,640
professor Harvey told seven-thirty quote

1135
00:53:54,099 --> 00:53:52,460
deaths have occurred serious admissions

1136
00:53:56,589 --> 00:53:54,109
to hospital from this particular

1137
00:53:59,079 --> 00:53:56,599
substance in quote associate professor

1138
00:54:02,170 --> 00:53:59,089
Harvey said while it was good to see the

1139
00:54:04,780 --> 00:54:02,180
TGA crack down on mms Australia the

1140
00:54:05,130 --> 00:54:04,790
infringement notices didn't go far

1141
00:54:08,530 --> 00:54:05,140
enough

1142
00:54:10,390 --> 00:54:08,540
quote their website MMS Australia is

1143
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:10,400
still promoting and selling these

1144
00:54:15,970 --> 00:54:13,010
products or be it with a disclaimer that

1145
00:54:18,070 --> 00:54:15,980
these products are quote Church

1146
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:18,080
sacraments and quote and not

1147
00:54:22,390 --> 00:54:20,810
therapeutics Goods and quote he said and

1148
00:54:24,700 --> 00:54:22,400
there's quite a bit

1149
00:54:28,569 --> 00:54:24,710
water that story but I'll certainly link

1150
00:54:30,670 --> 00:54:28,579
to those articles on this week's show

1151
00:54:32,920 --> 00:54:30,680
notes and in fact there's even a short

1152
00:54:35,519 --> 00:54:32,930
video about that you can watch as well

1153
00:54:39,099 --> 00:54:35,529
and while we're talking about

1154
00:54:40,299 --> 00:54:39,109
coronavirus and associated matters I was

1155
00:54:43,510 --> 00:54:40,309
on the skeptics guide to the universe

1156
00:54:46,750 --> 00:54:43,520
podcast last week and I always enjoy

1157
00:54:49,089 --> 00:54:46,760
being on the show as a guest rogue and I

1158
00:54:51,299 --> 00:54:49,099
made the comment along the lines that we

1159
00:54:53,170 --> 00:54:51,309
in Australia were horrified to see

1160
00:54:55,210 --> 00:54:53,180
protesters in the United States

1161
00:54:59,769 --> 00:54:55,220
demanding freedom and holding up bizarre

1162
00:55:02,500 --> 00:54:59,779
signs about covert 19 and even toting

1163
00:55:05,019 --> 00:55:02,510
guns and rifles and things like that and

1164
00:55:07,809 --> 00:55:05,029
I said how bizarre it was for us to see

1165
00:55:11,859 --> 00:55:07,819
that it seems I spoke a little bit too

1166
00:55:14,289 --> 00:55:11,869
soon that very weekend in Sydney and

1167
00:55:17,289 --> 00:55:14,299
especially Melbourne protesters turned

1168
00:55:21,089 --> 00:55:17,299
up at the the parliaments the town halls

1169
00:55:24,329 --> 00:55:21,099
carrying all sorts of bizarre signs and

1170
00:55:28,779 --> 00:55:24,339
claiming all sorts of bizarre claims

1171
00:55:49,150 --> 00:55:28,789
I'll play you a short excerpt from what

1172
00:55:51,309 --> 00:55:49,160
some of them had to say in the spring I

1173
00:55:53,490 --> 00:55:51,319
do not want anybody watching and

1174
00:55:56,079 --> 00:55:53,500
tracking and listening to me breathe I

1175
00:55:57,910 --> 00:55:56,089
want transparency from the government we

1176
00:56:00,190 --> 00:55:57,920
want to know why 5g towers that haven't

1177
00:56:01,839 --> 00:56:00,200
had safety studies done probably no

1178
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:01,849
industry studies have been going up

1179
00:56:05,769 --> 00:56:03,650
without the people's consent so you know

1180
00:56:07,930 --> 00:56:05,779
the fascism will be here every weekend

1181
00:56:11,710 --> 00:56:07,940
until we get our power back and the

1182
00:56:13,390 --> 00:56:11,720
lockdown now there is there are doctors

1183
00:56:16,269 --> 00:56:13,400
all over the internet who are being

1184
00:56:17,740 --> 00:56:16,279
censored for talking out about the lies

1185
00:56:19,299 --> 00:56:17,750
that the media and the government is

1186
00:56:21,309 --> 00:56:19,309
telling us about this they are being

1187
00:56:23,170 --> 00:56:21,319
censored and yet our mate Bill Gates he

1188
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:23,180
can get on there talk about anything he

1189
00:56:32,690 --> 00:56:30,620
okay all right let me say this is all

1190
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:32,700
about the New World Order right the New

1191
00:56:38,300 --> 00:56:34,890
World Order Channel nine straight off

1192
00:56:40,670 --> 00:56:38,310
their website nine honey new world order

1193
00:56:45,290 --> 00:56:40,680
reduce know what the new world order is

1194
00:56:48,410 --> 00:56:45,300
you better go look it up the new world

1195
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:48,420
order channel 9 this is part of the New

1196
00:56:53,360 --> 00:56:50,970
World Order the globalist plan to

1197
00:56:57,490 --> 00:56:53,370
enslave us why take away our rights

1198
00:57:01,790 --> 00:56:57,500
agenda 21 I've been to all the guy who's

1199
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:01,800
17 families today on Mother's Day really

1200
00:57:15,170 --> 00:57:13,070
the audio of the protesters is courtesy

1201
00:57:17,900 --> 00:57:15,180
of The Nine Network and the Seven

1202
00:57:20,060 --> 00:57:17,910
Network it's amazing to think that in

1203
00:57:23,180 --> 00:57:20,070
the minds of these people the reason

1204
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:23,190
people are dying in the nursing home or

1205
00:57:30,500 --> 00:57:27,690
in the aged care home is because they

1206
00:57:33,410 --> 00:57:30,510
had flu vaccinations I shouldn't be

1207
00:57:35,150 --> 00:57:33,420
surprised I am a little surprised I

1208
00:57:39,500 --> 00:57:35,160
shouldn't be surprised luckily I think

1209
00:57:42,740 --> 00:57:39,510
this is still a tiny minority but these

1210
00:57:45,140 --> 00:57:42,750
people are getting their conspiracy

1211
00:57:47,570 --> 00:57:45,150
theories directly from the internet I

1212
00:57:51,940 --> 00:57:47,580
would suspect from conspiracy theory

1213
00:57:54,350 --> 00:57:51,950
sites and YouTube We certainly have some

1214
00:57:56,260 --> 00:57:54,360
conspiracy theorists here in Australia

1215
00:57:59,090 --> 00:57:56,270
who we've covered on the show before but

1216
00:58:04,290 --> 00:57:59,100
I'm a little bit sad to say that this

1217
00:58:21,730 --> 00:58:04,300
sort of rot is here in Australia

1218
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:24,200
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1219
00:58:30,170 --> 00:58:26,010
zone podcast and thank you thank you

1220
00:58:32,930 --> 00:58:30,180
thank you to the people who continue to

1221
00:58:36,070 --> 00:58:32,940
support the skeptic zone financially at

1222
00:58:39,770 --> 00:58:36,080
the moment until things get back to

1223
00:58:42,350 --> 00:58:39,780
whatever normal is and I can get back to

1224
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:42,360
my film and TV work this is really my

1225
00:58:45,470 --> 00:58:44,010
only source of income so I really

1226
00:58:48,050 --> 00:58:45,480
appreciate the people especially in the

1227
00:58:51,680 --> 00:58:48,060
last week who have been chipping in very

1228
00:58:55,220 --> 00:58:51,690
generous donations and you can chip in

1229
00:58:58,400 --> 00:58:55,230
at skeptic zone TV just follow the

1230
00:59:02,170 --> 00:58:58,410
PayPal or patreon link at patreon it's

1231
00:59:05,570 --> 00:59:02,180
skeptic zone or you can use the the

1232
00:59:09,050 --> 00:59:05,580
PayPal meme and that's all as TV anyway

1233
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:09,060
that's all they're on skeptic zone TV

1234
00:59:14,870 --> 00:59:11,730
and it's good to see may not over at

1235
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:14,880
Maynard comm today you doing his regular

1236
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:18,210
weekly live TV shows or online shows you

1237
00:59:24,200 --> 00:59:20,370
can watch on your big screen if you hook

1238
00:59:26,870 --> 00:59:24,210
up to face book via whatever method you

1239
00:59:29,750 --> 00:59:26,880
use or just watch it on your platform of

1240
00:59:32,660 --> 00:59:29,760
choice every Friday night at 8:30

1241
00:59:35,510 --> 00:59:32,670
Sydney time so Friday Sydney time at

1242
00:59:39,560 --> 00:59:35,520
8:30 p.m. Sydney time Maynard does his

1243
00:59:41,690 --> 00:59:39,570
one-man Mad Club live it's hilarious so

1244
00:59:44,150 --> 00:59:41,700
please check it out at may not come

1245
00:59:46,010 --> 00:59:44,160
today you now coming up soon on the

1246
00:59:48,260 --> 00:59:46,020
skeptic zone we should be able to bring

1247
00:59:49,820 --> 00:59:48,270
you a think tank session just like the

1248
00:59:52,070 --> 00:59:49,830
old days of the skeptic zone where the

1249
00:59:54,080 --> 00:59:52,080
reporters would gather together at their

1250
00:59:55,580 --> 00:59:54,090
club at the end of the street the club

1251
00:59:58,280 --> 00:59:55,590
at the end of the street I think might

1252
01:00:00,680 --> 00:59:58,290
be opening again soon I'm not sure at

1253
01:00:03,740 --> 01:00:00,690
the moment the carpark of the club is

1254
01:00:06,260 --> 01:00:03,750
being used for covert 19 testing but the

1255
01:00:08,150 --> 01:00:06,270
reporters are some of them at least and

1256
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:08,160
I are going to get together online and

1257
01:00:14,510 --> 01:00:11,850
do a online think tank hope to bring you

1258
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:14,520
that very soon it'll be really nice to

1259
01:00:19,610 --> 01:00:17,010
to chat with all the wonderful reporters

1260
01:00:21,710 --> 01:00:19,620
and if you want to see the reporters for

1261
01:00:23,840 --> 01:00:21,720
yourself see their faces behind the

1262
01:00:26,540 --> 01:00:23,850
voices if you go to skip tech zone dot

1263
01:00:30,140 --> 01:00:26,550
TV and click the contacts link you'll

1264
01:00:30,390 --> 01:00:30,150
see a list of images and what I had some

1265
01:00:34,109 --> 01:00:30,400
by

1266
01:00:36,089 --> 01:00:34,119
they are too but for this week

1267
01:00:43,079 --> 01:00:36,099
this is Richard Saunders signing off

1268
01:00:45,150 --> 01:00:43,089
from Sydney Australia you've been

1269
01:00:50,609 --> 01:00:45,160
listening to the skeptic zone podcast

1270
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:50,619
please visit our website at WWDC be for

1271
01:00:56,299 --> 01:00:53,650
show notes contacts and to access the

1272
01:00:59,609 --> 01:00:56,309
bat catalog of episodes going back to

1273
01:01:03,240 --> 01:00:59,619
2008 you can follow the skeptic zone

1274
01:01:05,670 --> 01:01:03,250
podcast on twitter at skeptic zone visit

1275
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:05,680
our facebook page or leave a review on

1276
01:01:12,390 --> 01:01:09,010
iTunes you can also support the skeptic

1277
01:01:14,730 --> 01:01:12,400
zone via patreon or PayPal the skeptic

1278
01:01:16,500 --> 01:01:14,740
zone podcast is an independent

1279
01:01:18,900 --> 01:01:16,510
production the views and opinions

1280
01:01:21,029 --> 01:01:18,910
expressed on the skeptic zone are not

1281
01:01:24,010 --> 01:01:21,039
necessarily those of Australian skeptics

1282
01:01:35,870 --> 01:01:24,020
or any other sceptical organisation

1283
01:01:40,350 --> 01:01:38,340
hello people who listen after the music

1284
01:01:43,020 --> 01:01:40,360
yes it's time for the dice game the

1285
01:01:45,810 --> 01:01:43,030
dígame one died two dice whatever and

1286
01:01:49,650 --> 01:01:45,820
this week I'm going to be using a

1287
01:01:51,240 --> 01:01:49,660
six-sided die it's the alien one so it's

1288
01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:51,250
got a picture of an alien on it and

1289
01:01:56,370 --> 01:01:54,250
little aircraft a little UFOs and things

1290
01:01:58,610 --> 01:01:56,380
like that and joining me this week is

1291
01:02:01,620 --> 01:01:58,620
our guest a Linda Brown hello Linda

1292
01:02:03,270 --> 01:02:01,630
hello and you can see me say you're

1293
01:02:04,140 --> 01:02:03,280
looking at the dice now yeah there it is

1294
01:02:06,420 --> 01:02:04,150
isn't it lovely

1295
01:02:09,420 --> 01:02:06,430
oh yes okay Leigh Leigh it's an

1296
01:02:12,360 --> 01:02:09,430
interesting I yeah it's alright so how

1297
01:02:15,030 --> 01:02:12,370
the game works is every week I challenge

1298
01:02:16,650 --> 01:02:15,040
my audience to guess the numbers that

1299
01:02:22,470 --> 01:02:16,660
are going to come up using his psychic

1300
01:02:24,210 --> 01:02:22,480
powers they're dumb all right I bet I've

1301
01:02:29,190 --> 01:02:24,220
got a 1 in 6 chance of getting it wrong

1302
01:02:31,740 --> 01:02:29,200
I bet you do and because you're here we

1303
01:02:34,550 --> 01:02:31,750
go I can use one of these because you're

1304
01:02:39,150 --> 01:02:34,560
looking I'm going to use a little

1305
01:02:40,740 --> 01:02:39,160
plastic container oh yeah so I'm putting

1306
01:02:42,900 --> 01:02:40,750
it in there all right so you can verify

1307
01:02:47,610 --> 01:02:42,910
for everybody that the numbers come up

1308
01:02:50,220 --> 01:02:47,620
other know do your best anyway so folks

1309
01:02:59,750 --> 01:02:50,230
at home and a Linda what number do you

1310
01:03:07,140 --> 01:03:04,800
tip that so you can see maybe the other

1311
01:03:10,020 --> 01:03:07,150
way around look underneath Oh

1312
01:03:13,620 --> 01:03:10,030
so it says six but on the other sides

1313
01:03:19,290 --> 01:03:13,630
one alright so that's it you sound like

1314
01:03:28,290 --> 01:03:19,300
a psychic practice let's try it again

1315
01:03:30,990 --> 01:03:28,300
here we go what's your guess boy and

1316
01:03:31,830 --> 01:03:31,000
I'll tip that so you can see it's got

1317
01:03:36,090 --> 01:03:31,840
three three

1318
01:03:40,710 --> 01:03:36,100
well threes next to four it is see

1319
01:03:43,910 --> 01:03:40,720
you're amazing okay let's get last

1320
01:03:51,860 --> 01:03:43,920
psychic guess what do you think

1321
01:03:54,430 --> 01:03:51,870
No - all right I was looking into the

1322
01:03:57,530 --> 01:03:54,440
future that's what it was

1323
01:04:00,260 --> 01:03:57,540
well you know I mean when I look at four

1324
01:04:03,170 --> 01:04:00,270
there's actually one two and one and two

1325
01:04:04,580 --> 01:04:03,180
so my goodness I was just when I hit I

1326
01:04:06,230 --> 01:04:04,590
was just when I had I was looking into

1327
01:04:08,150 --> 01:04:06,240
three into the future I think I'll have

1328
01:04:11,720 --> 01:04:08,160
to score all those for you in that case

1329
01:04:14,900 --> 01:04:11,730
and that's how that's what the psychics

1330
01:04:17,060 --> 01:04:14,910
would save would ever tell psychics for